Seize the Castle

[Cagey]

Slightly different from the standard map idea.

The Story: the Lord of Castle Major has died leaving no clear heir. All the potential candidates to take over his position are scattered around the castle with their supporters. When news of the Lord's death spreads fighting breaks out amongst the heirs. Whoever controls the castle by eliminating their rivals will succeed the Lord.

This picture is just something I mocked up in Sims to give a vague idea - it'll take someone with a lot more graphical expertise than me to develop it. I imagine cut-away views of the towers. Possibly there could be an inner wall with it's own towers and gate. There could be additional buildings, armoury, stables etc. inside the courtyard.



Commands - each wall tower, has 3 levels, each level a territory. Every tower has a door into the courtyard on the bottom level and a door onto each adjacent wall top (each wall top a territory) on the second level. Control each of the 3 levels and 1 unit is autodeployed on the top level of each tower. Control the tower plus BOTH adjacent walls gives another unit to be placed anywhere. Perhaps there could be an added wrinkle by the gate - control both gate towers and the wall between them for 2 units maybe... The top level of each tower may bombard the adjacent towers on either side.

The Keep has 4 levels, each level with several rooms - you'd probably need floorplan pics, kinda like the cities in the GB map or the war zones of Africa. Levels 1, 2 and 3 are commands worth 2. More than one stairway accesses each level. Level 4, the top, is only worth 1 but may bombard any of the wall towers.

The Courtyard is split into sectors and is initially neutral with 1 unit in each sector.

That's all I got so far - anyone interested?

 

[ndrm31]

I like it

 

[FLAGG]

I think it is interesting..........

FLAGG

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

Seize the Kaaba

Very creative Cagey. Reminds me of this ... The holiest place for Islam

 

[FLAGG]

I like Castle stores..........this idea of Cagey's has had me thinking. This map/castle could be fun and challenging. I wanted to wait to respond until I had some real thoughts together. I am going to expand on some of Cagey's ideas. Some ideas:

The Keep: As Cagey descried, but 2 doors on ground floor. 2 windows on 3rd floor. (thus all 4 sides of the keep have an opening). Owning the roof (4th floor) means that you can bombard any space in the courtyard - except the inside of the church, armory, or stable. I am not sure you should be able to bombard the tower tops......or wall tops. The keep would definitely have cutaways for the 2nd, 3rd, and roof to the side of the map. I think this map might work best in plan view so that one could easily see all sides of the keep. 1st floor of the keep could be on the main plan. 3 levels of the tower could be done right at the tower........there would only be one room per level with the tower.

Wall towers: Can bombard any area they touch - inside the courtyard or outside the castle. Tower touches AT LEAST 2 regions in the courtyard and outside the castle. You must own the full tower (all three levels) to bombard.

The courtyard: Divided into 4 regions - Church, Armory, Stable, and Well (all explained below)

Church: Building within the courtyard. Owning it is an auto deploy of +1 per turn, for the strength religion had.

Armory/ Stable: Owning either is an auto deploy of +1. Buildings can not be bombarded by keep or towers.

Area surrounding outside of castle: Divided into 4 regions of several territories each, including a village (like the dragon map). Owning any one of the regions causes and auto deploy of +2 at the village for gaining community support of the surrounding land. OWNING all 4 regions around the castle is a +5(+10?) for each region per turn, AND A SIEGE of the CASTLE has begun. It is very hard to hold all regions because any of the towers could bombard anything outside of castle.

A Siege of the Castle: Not only is the surrounding land pulling in a big bonus of troops per turn, BUT all the outer tower regions start to decay one army each level of the tower - like the Africa map. REASON: The food supply is cut off - and the KEEP in the middle is holding all the food and no longer giving it to the outer wall.

The well: A region in the courtyard surrounds the water well for the keep. To own the whole region would be a +1 bonus at the well itself, AND cause all the regions in the central keep to decay - like the Africa map. This might be too extreme - and needs play testing - but my idea is that the well has influence on the well being of the keep, and one way to weaken the keep from the outside is to control its water supply.

Courtyard walls: There is a walkway on top the wall. On both sides of the wall are thin spaces, the length of the wall, that are neutral 5 - that act like the SEA OF JAPAN. They return to neutral 5 at the end of the turn. This way it is possible with hooks, ropes, and ladders to scale the wall. It takes going thru neutral 5s to get up the wall, and also down the other side.
EXAMPLE: You have an army of 20 troops outside the wall. On your turn you could climb the wall rolling to get thru 5 neutral. The enemy has 5 troops on top the wall. You would then fight them. With fair dice you now have 10 troops on top the wall. You could then stop your attack with 10 on the wall, attack either surrounding tower, or climb down the wall to the courtyard (having to go thru another neutral 5). The wall could also be attacked from the courtyard side, in the same fashion.

KEEP walls with the 3rd story windows. The windows of the keep on the third floor can be entered by passing thru a +10 neutral. They are harder walls to climb, With the idea that you are now climbing a 3 story wall.

------------------------------------

This would need tons of play testing to check all my arbitrary bonus and decay rates. And I have no map making skills. All I was trying to do was generate thoughts and ideas. I want to keep this cool concept going........

I wanted to incorporate more of the lives of a castle, introduce the church, armory, stable, include villages outside the castle, introduce that the food supply comes from outside, the possibility of a siege, introduce the importance of the castle water well, and allow the walls to be climbed.

So what does everyone think??

FLAGG

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

Another Interesting Resemblance - Seize the Kaaba

The well: A region in the courtyard surrounds the water well for the keep. To own the whole region would be a +1 bonus at the well itself, AND cause all the regions in the central keep to decay - like the Africa map. This might be too extreme - and needs play testing - but my idea is that the well has influence on the well being of the keep, and one way to weaken the keep from the outside is to control its water supply.

So what does everyone think??

FLAGG

Another interesting resemblance ...

#2 in the drawing) The entrance is a door set 2.13 m (7 ft) above the ground on the north-eastern wall of the Kaaba, which acts as the façade. In 1979 the 300 kg gold doors made by chief artist Ahmad bin Ibrahim Badr, replaced the old silver doors made by his father, Ibrahim Badr in 1942. There is a wooden staircase on wheels, usually stored in the mosque between the arch-shaped gate of Banū Shaybah and the Zamzam Well.

According to Islamic belief, it is a miraculously-generated source of water from God, which began thousands of years ago when Abraham's (Ibrāhīm) infant son Ishmael (ʼIsmāʻīl) was thirsty and kept crying for water. Millions of pilgrims visit the well each year while performing the Hajj or Umrah pilgrimages, in order to drink its water.

Muslims believe that the Zamzam well is a contemporary miracle, never having gone dry despite the millions of litres of water attributed to the well consumed every year. It had been deepened several times in history during periods of severe droughts.

By the way ... In May 2011, a BBC London investigation found that water marketed as having been taken from the Zamzam Well contained high levels of nitrate, potentially harmful bacteria, and arsenic at levels three times the legal limit in the UK. Arsenic is a carcinogen, raising concerns that Muslims who regularly consume commercial Zamzam water in large quantities may be exposed to higher risks of cancer. The British Food Standards Agency has in the past issued warnings about water claiming to be from the Zamzam Well containing dangerous levels of arsenic

 

[Cagey]

BadDice: the resemblance to the Kaaba was purely coincidental and I really think it's a good idea to steer well clear (by a thousand miles) of any reference to any religion, particularly Islam. No disrespect intended.

Flagg, I dig where you're coming from, and I like some of the ideas, the well, church, stable, armoury, but the siege idea is more suited to a 2 player game, I think, and the more screen-space outside the castle then the smaller the castle would have to be and since there's a lot going on inside the castle I think it would probably get too tiny and cluttered.

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

BadDice: the resemblance to the Kaaba was purely coincidental and I really think it's a good idea to steer well clear (by a thousand miles) of any reference to any religion, particularly Islam. No disrespect intended.

Flagg, I dig where you're coming from, and I like some of the ideas, the well, church, stable, armoury, but the siege idea is more suited to a 2 player game, I think, and the more screen-space outside the castle then the smaller the castle would have to be and since there's a lot going on inside the castle I think it would probably get too tiny and cluttered.

That is ABSOLUTELY ... positively true Cagey. As we are all aware of ... religion has nothing to do with wars and diplomacy around the world ... it's not evident at all at the present time and never has throughout human history ... and therefore would completely, totally, utterly, not make any sense as part of a world conquest strategy game either ... No disrespect taken ....

 

[patsfan44]

That is ABSOLUTELY ... positively true Cagey. As we are all aware of ... religion has nothing to do with wars and diplomacy around the world ... it's not evident at all at the present time and never has throughout human history ... and therefore would completely, totally, utterly, not make any sense as part of a world conquest strategy game either ... No disrespect taken ....

Crusades? Jihads? Alliances?

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

Crusades? Jihads? Alliances?

Did you say "Jihads"???

Actually ... there's an idea pats! ...

You know how in 12 Domains you get 25 troops on the dragon when you capture Draig Tower? and how you get in Nukes ... I forgot how many ... 200 maybe ... 250 reinforcments ... I forgot ... anyway ... in "Seize the Kabba" ... once they cut your food supply ... and water supply from the well, and you die ... in the name of Allah of course ... (that's what Jihad is, "holy war") you go to heaven and get reinforcements of 72 virgins ...

 

[patsfan44]

Did you say "Jihads"???

Actually ... there's an idea pats! ...

You know how in 12 Domains you get 25 troops on the dragon when you capture Draig Tower? and how you get in Nukes ... I forgot how many ... 200 maybe ... 250 reinforcments ... I forgot ... anyway ... in "Seize the Kabba" ... once they cut your food supply ... and water supply from the well, and you die ... in the name of Allah of course ... (that's what Jihad is, "holy war") you go to heaven and get reinforcements of 72 virgins ...

lol at the reinforcements of virgins...

 

[empirejeff]

Auto deploy is awesome.

 

[Jalthise]

+1 for The original and for Flagg's additions. I've heard people say they like simple maps, but I prefer more complicated maps and think we could use something more than Africa and 12 Domains. I really prefer maps where skill matters more than luck, and that has a lot to do with how many meaningful decisions need to be made in a game.

 

[FLAGG]

Jalthise - thanks for comments.

Cagney - thanks for digging where I am coming from. I do, however, disagree that we can not incorporate my idea of a siege into this map. Look how many territories are on some of the maps. I think there would be plenty of room to have a big map, and broken out plans of the keep off to one side, or at the 4 corners.

I think the siege idea would add a lot of interest.

For example: A few people could be fighting inside the castles walls for control. If someone takes ownership of the everything inside the walls they would win most likely win - because they can bombard and take care of the outside easily.

BUT the siege adds a new dimension..........because while the fighting is going on inside the walls - someone could be working on taking the whole exterior of the castle - it would be hard to do - but IF THEY got it it could be a whole new game. They would get large army bonuses a turn, and the castles food supply weekend (as I described above). After a few turns under siege - if two or three players were left in the castle they would have to join together and end the siege - or else they would be swallowed up and destroyed by the people outside the castle.

Kind of reminds me of the power of the dragon in 12 domains, if someone actually gets it. Only once the tower is taken - it is all about the tower and who holds it. With the siege - one could start.........and stop.........and various times during the game.

Don't you think this would be an interesting twist to have in the game?

FLAGG

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

FLAGG, I think your ideas are good. So what if it fits 1v1 better? I can't think of a map more suited for 1v1 than NUKES ... and still you see people playing it in all different formations all the time ... There is nothing wrong with a map that's suited best for 1v1 ... After all it is the most popular form of play ... and ... as you said ... it can actually be played by many as well (just like NUKES can ...)

(some may argue that any map is played best in 1v1)

 

[Cagey]

Flagg I think you need to come up with some form of graphic to show your ideas - it doesn't have to be a finished map. I know top-down would be easier, but personally i like the idea of the isometric viewpoint (as in my original pic), I think the 3rd dimension would give it a nice flavour.

iLoveBadDice, 1v1 the most popular form of play? Really? Not on this site.

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

iLoveBadDice, 1v1 the most popular form of play? Really? Not on this site.

It's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact ... if you count the number of games played for each formation out of the close to 180,000 games played, it is an undeniable fact that 1v1 had been played more than any other formation.

You don't need to physically count, you can just search the archive, and let the computer do the counting ... just make sure to chose a high limit for the size, 200,000 would be good ...

 

[Cagey]

Well that surprises me, maybe there's a lot of 1v1 real time games... I know you specialise in them, but you're the exception rather than the rule I think

 

[iLoveBadDiceBANNED]

Well that surprises me, maybe there's a lot of 1v1 real time games... I know you specialise in them, but you're the exception rather than the rule I think

I agree it's a "surprising" fact, cause it may seem otherwise. Yes, I would guess that the 1v1 real time games may have something to do with it.

I would strongly disagree though that I "specalise" in them. You actually made me count ... I played 92 real time games out of 841 games, that's 10% ... not exactly "specialization" ... and that ratio will only go down as ... I no longer play those ... As a matter of fact my last real time game ended on April 19th, 2013, over four months ago, and as soon as I stopped playing real time games my rating jumped 2000 points ... (playing low rated players is very costly)

However, if you are referring to head to head games, 100% of my games are head to head, and what I specialize in is strategic thinking. The same strategic thinking and risk assessment is applied in multi players games. However, multi players games present many elements of unpredictablity, like some player making a completely illogical move ... for whatever reason ... and ruining the game for everyone ... I personally prefer not to deal with those, and minimize the random elements.

I chose to stick to 1v1 cause there is no doubt that it minimizes the risk elements, and I personally would rather have the minimal number of variables which are out of my control.

At the same time, I have a lot of respect for people who play those games, despite all those variables. I assure you though, that you can't be successful in multi players games without using EXACTLY the same stratetigical thinking that I use in 1v1 games.

 

[Cagey]

yeah i meant you specialise in 1v1, not 1v1 realtime. And that's fine, you know, it's what you like, so whatever. I don't really get it though: if you want to maximise strategy and control and minimise unpredictability then I would have thought chess would be the game.