MetaGame Q & A

[masterjskye]

Keeping Track

How can I keep track of the game, or know when a round has ended or is about to begin?

You can keep track of active games on the main metagame thread, on the first post. Once the final game ends there will be at least a 24 hour "ceasefire" and teams will be informed by mail that the next round is about to start. After that timer ends teams may start submitting moves, for a further 24 hours.

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Initial Deployment

Once the first round begins, you will have 24 hours to pick 2 territories.

If the same territory gets attacked by more than one team, they play a game for control and have 30 days to get it completed. The rest of us have pretty quiet month if that happens.

If no dropzone battles occur for control of an initial territory then we move straight onto round 2. You receive move orders and then battle orders may be given (over another period of 24 hours). This is where the real game begins.

what happens if a territory doesn't get picked at all? Will it just stay unoccupied? So someone could take it without a fight?

Yes, unpicked territories will remain unoccupied and free to being taken without a fight by the first team that invades.


Since there will be some games for control of initial terts that are selected by more than one team, are we going to call that "round 1" and wait for those games to end before we start the "real" game?

Yes


Are the choices of initial terts made in secret?

They are not secret, they are made out in the open during the first move order phase.

OK, then, seems like that definitely will cause everyone to wait until the last minute to see what terts are open that they can grab without a fight. I am definitely in favor of all attacks being made out in the open, but seems like this will just cause a stampede in the last couple of minutes, whoever is lucky enough to be able to be online at the end has a distinct advantage.

I think that precisely because most won't want to fight for first territories, there is some advantage to getting initial orders (or at least partial orders) in quickly. There will be at least some "first come first served" effect. Also if you wait until the end, you risk choosing territories at the same time others do inadvertently.

Depends on what terts you pick, you old baldy, you. Jumping in early with choices in S America or Aussie seems like a recipe for having to battle immediately.

I think players have the option of trying to stake their claim early and put others off of trying to take their land, or wait until later to see what is left neutral. There are enough territories for everyone, it's up to you how you go about it.

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Making Moves

So after the timer runs out on which thread do we post our move orders/territory picks?

You post your moves on to the main metagame thread.


Do we have to submit all move orders each round in one lump or can we submit 1, but wait to see what others do if we wish before submitting the rest? The siege rule will make things very interesting by the way.

You may submit your moves in any order you wish, as long as they are within the allocated time period. Moves will be implemented in a loop system, with the first move of the first team being processed first, then the second team's first move next, and so on.


Say I'm the first to get a move order in. Everyone else follows, and I'm first to put in my second order.
In that case it just makes sense to wait on all your other moves until everyone else is in. However, what about the clock? I'm assuming that this all has to happen within 24 hours, so if you're waiting for someone else to put in their moves, you theoretically could get shut out..... so that's a consideration.

Well, it's up to you if you want to wait for someone else to make their moves but it's not a necessity. You can submit every move you intend to make on your first post. If you're first in line your team gets first place in every move "loop", up to the number of valid moves they submitted in that post. However, everyone can see your moves, and are free to submit something that could over-ride or alter what you have submitted. There will be no way to know how it will play out apart from the first moves of each team until the 24 hours is up, or everyone has submitted all their moves.

So say, every team except one has submitted their first orders and they think that they can now start submitting second orders and so on. Then, two minutes before the deadline, the one team that hadn't submitted any move orders yet might theoretically throw all the previous orders (except first round) into disarray by making one smart move? Interesting thoughts

Will there be any public registry of moves made, or a teams move order count?

Yes, there is a record on the main metagame thread front page. The move orders that teams have in the bank are displayed on the main map picture.


what happens if someone posts his move then edits his post?

No editing allowed. Any moves made are final. If you see anyone has changed a move then call them out for it.

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Cypher Chains

What on earth is a cypher chain and how does it work?

A cypher chain allows you to post a bunch of moves that could cover a very wide range of contingencies.

Until you become accustomed to using the cypher - I recommend you look at this picture. Without it cypher moves may appear completely random.

So, looking at the picture -
you start at A.
If A is valid your next move attempted would be B
If A is invalid, it is disregarded and your next move attempted would be C

So, you just do that all the way down, following green if the move was made successfully (ie hasn't already been invalidated by another teams play) and following red if the move was not made successfully. Obviously an unsuccessful move costs nothing.

So move O for example will only ever come to pass if moves A, C & G all fail.

Alternatively there is a way you can read the cypher without even looking at the picture - that is to write out the full list like the one below. The numbers in brackets represent the move that would precede the current one. So, something with (O-) beside it means that it will not happen unless whatever you put in as move 0 failed.

Be careful about submitting a cypher chain multiple times, because there is a chance that because the initial move was valid on the first go through that when it comes to the second time it will not be valid, and it could take you down the opposite chain path.

Master already attempted one explanation. I'll attempt to explain it differently. Sometimes hearing things in a different way can help.

We posted this chain: A-blitz middle east; C-blitz euro russia; G-attack euro russia. In effect, all we're saying is: blitz middle east; but, if that move is invalid, blitz euro russia; but, if that too is invalid, attack euro russia.

To make things clearer, we might have posted the chain like this:

A: blitz middle east
B: N/A
C: blitz euro russia
D: N/A
E: N/A
F: N/A
G: attack euro russia

Basically, in this chain, we're only committing ourselves to one move. Had we wanted to submit two or three moves, we would have inserted moves in slots B, D, E, F, etc.

It might be helpful to think about the cypher as a little toy with a series of binary switches. You insert a ball at the apex of the pyramid (point A), and the ball falls according to how each switch is positioned. Thinking of it this way might help you realize how the 'switches' toward the top of the pyramid can shut off or activate whole sections of the lower parts of the pyramid. For example, if the ball falls from A to B, then there's no way for the ball to get back into the right side of the pyramid. For our purposes, that would mean that, if move A is valid, move C -- and any moves underneath C in the cypher chain -- will not be considered.

A:
B: (A+)
C: (A-)
D: (B+)
E: (B-)
F: (C+)
G: (C-)
H: (D+)
I: (D-)
J: (E+)
K: (E-)
L: (F+)
M: (F-)
N: (G+)
O: (G-)
P: (H+)
Q: (H-)
R: (I+)
S: (I-)
T: (J+)
U: (J-)
V: (K+)
W: (K-)
X: (L+)
Y: (L-)
Z: (M+)
1: (M-)
2: (N+)
3: (N-)
4: (O+)
5: (O-)

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Map Choices

"Defending teams issue 3 different maps (including all settings) to their attackers. Attackers may then choose which one they wish to play. The only limitations on this are that they have to be maps you have both agreed you want to play on, and it must be casual / chance."

Do defenders have to offer maps from the attacker's 13 list? Or can the defenders offer a choice of 3 maps, none of which made it onto the attacker's list of 13?

The idea behind picking maps is so that no one ever plays on a map they said they didn't want to. So you have to look at the chart and see which maps you both have green and pick 3 from there. Then invite the attackers and let them choose which one to join.


so essentially the defender may always play the settings he prefers right ? he can choose the same settings in all three maps he offers ?

Yes, the settings may be the same on all three just as long as the maps are different. Defenders get the home turf advantage.

However, if a surprise attack or a surprise stormtrooper attack is used then it is the attackers who choose the settings and map outright.

And for Neutrals?

who's deciding the map and settings in the case of two pretenders wanting to take a neutral map? The first takers count as defenders?

Since a country is no longer neutral once it has been invaded, the first team to do so will be considered the defenders.

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Territory Ownership

Is the metagame a team-game with individuals each owning terts or with teams jointly owning terts?

Teams jointly own territories on the Metagame.

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Neutrals

What about the inevitable neutral territories? Is is just going to be, use one of your move orders and you get it free?

Exactly. Neutral countries are free, but since you take them immediately without a fight they are open to being attacked on the same round by another team.

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Attacking

what about if country b attacks country C, can country b still be attacked by somewhere else after in the same round? so it attacks and defends at the same time?

Yes, country B may still be attacked in that scenario by somewhere other than country C. Only if a territory is under attack (under siege) does it lose the ability to attack.

And remember, you gain move orders for owning territories, but you do not have to use the move orders from the country you gained them from. You can attack in multiple directions from only one country, for example.

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Under Siege

If a region is attacked can you still attack from that region afterwards? Or if you are attacked in a region u can just defend from that region for the round?

No, you may not attack from a country that has already been attacked.

It's under SUBMITTING MOVES:

"The moment you make a move your army will begin attacking in the Metagame. This is important, because it means that your army has already invaded your neighbour and their country is now under siege. If you're under siege you lose the ability to attack from said country. This will become a game in itself. A team completely under siege that does not get to use any move orders at all will still receive the move orders for use on the next round."

oh that's very important then... to attack first that is

yep....best defense is a quick offense (in some cases at least)

If one (or more) of your countries is under siege do you lose the ability to do (i) an attack, (ii) a surprise attack and a (iii) blitz attack from that country (countries) during that turn?

Yes. So the only thing you can do if your team found itself completely under siege would be Stormtroopers, Ninjas, or Nuke.

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Giving up a territory

If I can nuke myself, can I choose not to defend a territory for any reason?

Yes, if you want you can choose not to defend the territory.

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Surprise Attack

"Surprise Attack: Under normal circumstances, the defender gets his pick of map settings to offer to the attacker. This gives the defender a natural home-field advantage. However, for 2 move orders you can perform a surprise attack, that will catch them off guard and allow the attacker to choose the map & settings (As long as the map is within the accepted 13 of your competitors). A territory may only be surprise attacked once per round. If any other teams attack the territory on the same round, the team that used a surprise attack will choose the settings for everyone."

does this mean the surprise attackers choose one map and settings for the defending team, or three maps and settings for the defenders to select from?

Attackers choose the map and settings outright on a surprise attack - the defenders have no choice. Of course, any map chosen must be within the accepted range of both teams.

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Blitz

"cannot blitz attack someone if it is their last territory"

What is a last territory? Let's say my team has 4 territories at the beginning of a round, and all get blitzed and/or nuked. How do we determine, which is the last territory? Based on the order of the original move orders? Or based on the order of the actual moves (which can be different, as the blitz takes precedence)? Or should we say, in this scenario there is no "last" territory, as at the beginning of the turn we had 4?

Since the moves happen on the metaboard as soon as you issue the orders, a teams last territory would be defined as the very last territory they have a chance to defend. So if they had 4 territories at the start of the round, and 3 of them got blitzed straight away, the 4th and final territory would then be immune to further
blitzing or nuking, at least until they claim another territory.

If their other 3 territories had only been attacked and not straight out blitzed or nuked then you could still freely blitz or nuke their "last" unattacked territory.


When you have done a Blitz attack, does the follow up attack then have to be a regular attack? Or could it be a Surprise attack? Or even another Blitz attack?

So, for example, if you had 9 moves in your team kitty, could you then do a Blitz attack from Country A on Country B, followed by a Blitz attack on Country C from Country B, followed by a Blitz attack on Country D from Country C, all in the same turn ... where Country B was adjacent to Country A, Country C was adjacent to Country B, and Country D was adjacent to Country C?

Yes. That is what I meant when I said You can travel a large distance per turn, if you are willing to pay for it. Blitzing just instantly gets you a shiny new territory that you may instantly attack again from, with any type of move.

and with a Last Territory?

Say I had 2 territories left and 2 teams tried to blitz them both. What would happen?

You are not allowed to blitz or nuke a teams last territory - by that it means you are not allowed to wipe them off the map completely with one of these attacks. If, however, they had other territories on the board, and they were all under attack it would still be acceptable to blitz or nuke that territory, since they still have somewhere to call home. so in answer to your question - only one of the territories could be blitzed, and it would be by the team that attacked first.

Blitzing also doesn't count for a share of a teams last territories, or their move orders if eliminated. Only regular attacks entitle you to a slice of the pie, as it were.

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Nuke

Can you nuke a blitzed territory?

Yes


Can you nuke a last territory?

No

The nuke only cancels any incoming attacks on the country you drop it on. It can not undo previous attacks that have already left that country, since all attacks happen instantly if they are valid.

Hi masterjskye - I just wanted to revisit this now that we have the loop system for move orders in place. I think your previous answer above pretty much answers it, but just to be crystal clear:

One team sends in a set of ranked move orders including a series of Blitz Attacks from territory A to territory B, then from B to C, then from C to D. Another team notices this and decides to throw in a Nuke Attack to try and frustrate the first team's plans. The key thing is from your previous answer is that attacks that have already left a country still stand. So if the first team's Blitz Attacks from country A to B and from B to C have already happened in the loop system, then the second team firing a Nuke Attack at Country A or B (or both), will have no effect on the first team's Blitz Attack on Country C, nor on it's later move to Blitz attack from Country C to Country D. However, if the second team instead does its' Nuke Attack on Country C, that would stop the first team's Blitz Attack on Country D, as that move had yet to be actioned in the loop system.

If I am correct with my understanding, it means that any team planning a Nuke attack will have to very carefully calibrate which country they attack in which loop. If they fire the Nuke off in the wrong loop, the attacks they Blitz Attacks they may have been wanting to stop could already have left that country, and so it's only effect will be to make the territory they target neutral again. If this is correct, I like this aspect of the "fog of war", as it seems very realistic that you might fire off a Nuke too early or too late in a "real" war, when the action has already headed off elsewhere.

Yeah that's right.

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Commands

Do the commands held by a team give them the same number of extra move orders as the reinforcements you would get in a normal game?

Yes - commands grant the same amount of move orders as shown on the brief.
Teams gain command bonuses by starting the round with the complete command.

don't they have to keep the command for 1 round before they get the bonus...? I think otherwise it would be too easy to get command bonus and in the rules, it says holding a command gets you the bonus. But to hold it, it means to keep it for 1 round, that's how the risk gameplay is. You capture a command and if no one breaks it through the next round you get to use the bonus

Yeah that's the way Risk plays, but you don't all play your turns simultaneously in Risk. What we are playing here is quite removed from ordinary Risk, and some things are bound to have to change when you start playing it like this. They took the command and held it till this round so I thought they should get the +1. But then Capturing a whole command means you are guaranteed that amount of move orders at least once, on the next round. So - I can change the rules to what Hat7rick proposes, or keep it as it is. What do the rest of you think?

Like masterjskye, I assumed they would get the bonus on first round of holding the command.

I also assumed they would get the bonus that round. With the simultaneous nature of play, we can see that an opponent is about to own a continent. During that round is the time to break the potential command. Getting and holding for one round is too exclusive. We would rarely see bonuses (as I suspect we may rarely see bonuses for 2 rounds in a row). I prefer the way it is.

I agree. I also assumed that by holding the command for the round that they would get the bonus.

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Diplomacy

"There is to be no diplomacy in this war. It is an all out battle to the death, and it's every team for themselves. There is to be no Cahoots here. If anyone asks you to team up, or if you are thinking about trying to rig the game by weaving a little web of diplomacy behind the scenes I urge DO NOT Do It. Play the game honourably and you will be playing it properly. So that also counts for diplomatic agreements and messages as well - there are to be none of them. Consider this another unique aspect of the MetaGame."

What about messages and deals between teams? In a regular game we'd call it outside diplomacy but I don't think that really applies in the meta-game

On the contrary, I think it applies just as much if not more so in the metagame. There are to be no secret deals or hidden diplomacy. You play the board as you see it but plotting with an enemy team is not allowed


Is it okay to have diplomacy in the actual games?

No. Since this is just a 2v2 head to head tournament, there is really no need to be using diplomacy in-game. If you want to chat that's fine - just don't be teaming up in the metagame or even discussing your game plan.

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Doggy card

"and get one game on a territory of your choosing"

Can you attack nuked/blitzed territories, too?
If no, what happens if there are no territories you can legally attack? (This is not very probable, I admit, but still.)

No you will not be able to attack a blitzed or nuked area on a doggy card attack. In the unlikely event that there is nowhere you may legally play, you are bang outta luck. Like you say though.. it is highly improbable.

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Elimination

"Eliminating a team means gaining half their move orders if they use a doggy card and all their move orders if they do not"

When does this happen? Before or after the "doggy card"?

Assuming only one team has a claim to a share of their orders, you would get 50% of their moves, then they go to doggy mode - they can only attack one country that round and if they lose that game then whoever they attacked gets the other 50% of their orders.


Let's assume my team has 2 terts left, both are attacked, and we lose both. Who gets the unused moves then? Is it decided based on the order of the original move orders?

In that case we would split the moves between any teams that were attacking them on the round they were eliminated. If it cannot be evenly split the excess is lost.

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2v2v2?

The individual games are normal team games 2 vs 2, right? If we are attacked from two sides, do we still get to defend in both cases? Did I understand right, that this does not result in a 2 vs. 2 vs. 2 game, but in two separate defense games?

This is purely a 2v2 tournament, there will be no games with more than 2 teams. If a country has been attacked it may no longer be attacked again on the same round (except with a nuke).

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Site Bugs & Honour

If another series of bug strikes/server problems happen, and players miss their turns, whats the over all ruling? Gonna be a huge mess if some players start to miss turns and there is no pre-tourney ruling on this. Maybe just tough luck and carry on? or do you want every one to skip their turns to even things out?

I think in the spirit of fairness it should be agreed that if the site goes through something like that then the honorable thing to do would be to miss the same amount of turns. Just as good sportsmanship.

But, not everyone plays 100% honourably all the time (this is a war after all) and there might come a time where it is too great of a gift to turn down, and a team goes ahead and ruthlessly murders their idle opponents. I want it to be known this is Not against the rules. But it's one of those ones that you can come back to the metagame thread and tell everyone about the dirty deed.. everyone loves a bit of drama after all.

Although, to do this to someone's last territory... that would be considered really shitty.

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Substituting Players

If one of the two players in a team goes AWOL or just quits for some reason and the other wants to continue do we allow him to get a substitute player?

I'll allow each team to substitute one of their players once. Be this because they don't wish to play any more or they've been disqualified.

To allow for real life to happen, if you needed to go away on holiday or something you could draft in a friend to play for you for a bit. Or, if you don't have anyone in mind to ask, you share your password with your team-mate and ask them to play your shots for you.

ok the one-time deal sounds reasonable! or all teams having one sub anyway to make it fair! I don't think 1 person playing for 2 players makes it fair. it removes the team skill you need to win this and he will have a considerable advantage.

Only problem with that hat7rick is that if players have holidays booked in the foreseeable future, and not being able to have your partner play your turns, kinda means you cant really join this tourney if you don't have a sub. I am thinking about joining but just need to see all the rules 1st. I go away for a few days next week and if master j starts the tourney then, then i wont be able to join as i cant let my partner play my turns. I am sure its the same for many players.

stone: You can always just give somebody else you trust your password and let them play you for a while - after you return, you could change your password. That has happened in several of my games so far - and nobody minds. It might even have happened more often than I know, since those I know of have been communicated in the chat.

ok. fine for practical reasons we can make a ruling that 2 players are signed up but they are allowed to share their account details and if only 1 of them makes the plays is fine.

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Membership requirement

How many open slots do grunts need?

Grunts are going to have to sit this one out, or upgrade.

in my opinion grunts shouldn't be allowed because if they are out of slots suddenly they will give up territories without a fight which affects the meta.. Checking on all territories that have grunts to see if they have slots or not shouldnt be part of the skillset needed to win no ?

Disappointing from a grunt's standpoint, but that's a legitimate argument. I'd have to agree.