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I'm happy because:

What do you chose, points or recognition (medals banners toutney wins)?

  • points/ranks

    Votes: 44 58.7%
  • medals/tourneys

    Votes: 31 41.3%

  • Total voters
    75

Veni-Vidi-Vici

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BV, I never said that I don't want to play against you. I enjoy playing against you, I never had a problem with you in the games themselves and you are more than welcome to join as many of my open games as you wish, once you bring your rating back to your actual skill level. You posted about how happy you are and how you "thought I would make it a challenge" and how "I have no points and can enjoy playing the game" and I expressed that there is no challenge in stealing 100 points from the victims you stole a 100 points from. You didn't take anything from me, but you took from friends of mine, and other players, who play fairly and did not deserve to give you a 100 points just because you decided to take advantage of a loophole to artificially lower your points. I responded to your "I am so happy post" and advised you that if not playing for points makes you so happy, you should play beta, as I already advised you. I don't know about the unfair things you are describing, you should report them when they happen. Regardless if there is any wrongdoing there, they certainly don't make it right for you to use a loophole in the program to lower your points artificially. That is just not fair for other players for the reasons I already described in my previous posts on this matter, and it's being "that guy" which is against the two rules of Majcom.

I understand that you are not the first and not the only one who abused the points system in this manner, but you posted and bragged about the "challenge" so I responded to your post, and expressed that I don't consider this a "challenge", on the contrary.

I hope the coders fix that loophole. I would suggest charging the entrance fee when the tournament actually starts. I hope that in the meanwhile players would not abuse the points system in this manner.
 

th-child

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Yeah, before this escalates into something unpleasant:

The fact that you don't get your points back when you drop out ouf a tourney is not a loophole, it was a conscious decision so as not to reward 'quitters'.

I wasn't around that time of course, but I read it somewhere deep in one of the topics. The original creators of this rule didn't think anyone would abuse this rule and I think they were genuinely surprised when it first happened. BlueVelvet is not the first to do this, and Rosco isn't either (I think).

Now, I'd be happy to see this rule changed, and not even because of the 'loophole' but because I have nothing against 'quitters', and I think we should all be able to change our minds or leave tournies that don't seem to fill up without being punished. #QuittersOfTheWorldUnite

Even if there was a consensus to change it though, it won't happen. No major (or even minor) changes are going to be made in the current engine, all efforts are going into the new one. (You guys all can test that on the Beta tab. Please do.)

As for the matter of it being fair.
Using the loophole is certainly not against the rules, and I can see the excitement of it I guess, to some degree.

However, it is an etiquette problem (along with some others that BlueVelvet mentioned). Etiquette isn't really enforced here, nor should it be, it is something we, the users, create together.

Here are some examples:
It is not a must to wish good luck and say gg, but it is customary and newcomers pick up on that very quickly.

Also it is not against the rules to use diplo in 3-players game, but over the years people decided that it is somehow not okay. It is frowned upon now.

It is explicitly within the rules to break truces, still, I won't advise to do it to anyone. Or maybe I do: try it, and see what happens. I tell you what: huge sh.tstorm.

You shouldn't even agree with a 3rd party to break your truce for you, that will get you in trouble, too.

These are unwritten rules. Not even rules. Etiquette. This is how communities work, not sure you could explain it to an alien. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I think lowering your own score like this is starting to be frowned upon. It was a novelty when it first happened, now it is like not saying gg, and maybe later it will become like breaking truces.

It is not against the rules, and in this sense you certainly didn't do anything wrong, and you won't get warned or banned or anything but it seems like people don't like it these days.

My own personal opinion doesn't matter, but of course I have one, hehe. I think it is fair if you don't have games going on when you do it, and it is unfair when you do. People should have a chance to factor in your score when you start the game. Of course one's score usually changes midgame, sometimes quite dramatically, but lowering it intentionally is probably, I don't know... bad?

Please don't start a flame war, guys. We have a Cardinalsrule here, and we are not afraid to use him.
 

Veni-Vidi-Vici

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The fact that you don't get your points back when you drop out ouf a tourney is not a loophole, it was a conscious decision so as not to reward 'quitters'.

Well, it's possible to honor the original creator of the rule and to fix the loophole at the same time. Instead of the "pay when play starts" I suggested before, the coders can limit the numbers of entries to a particular tournament to 1, that way if you leave a tournament you do get penalized but you can't abuse the points system.
 

BlueVelvet

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I will agree with how th-child so eloquently put it. It was bad etiquette. I'm sick of some of the crap that some other players do that goes unoticed so I misplaced my etiquette on this occasion. I'm glad everyone else is so perfect though. I guess I will now become one of the many that ignores the forums, ignores team spirit and eventually gets board with the site and moves on. I won't lose sleep over it.
 

riskyone

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th-child worded that very well. Not only a great player, but a great contributor. One who offers both a general opinion and then his own. I like that. When someone can step back see it for what it is. Have their own opinion, but also let's others have theirs. Etiquette, unwritten rules, tales from the crypt. All part of MC. I learned the 3rd party breaking truce thing 5 years ago and I had planned on doing the move before the truce was even offered and when it went down. It got ugly. Then when I held out the olive branch. The players that backed me got upset with me and I had to explain that this guy would join games I was in and attack me. Made for a stressful time. It sounds like there is a fix, so I would like to see that. One entry per player, but as I gave th- credit for. That is just my opinion, not law.
 

Veni-Vidi-Vici

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Yeah, before this escalates into something unpleasant:

You don't think it's already "unpleasant" for the people who had points stolen from them? The ones who lost 100 points instead of 15, or those who won only 7 points instead of 45?

You don't think a proven cheating method already escalated to something very "unpleasant" to the victims of such cheating? You really believe that?

Please don't start a flame war, guys. We have a Cardinalsrule here, and we are not afraid to use him.

I did not see any demonstration of any "flames" in this debate, by any of the participants, including BlueVelvet. I think everyone has been respectful and addressed the issue, and their perception of it.

As I stated before, I never had a problem with BlueVelvet, and in this case I gave him the benefit of the doubt, and my problem is with the action as it can be repeated, and has already been repeated just today by BlueVelvet himself, and anyone else if it is an accepted thing to do and not a cheating method.

As I also stated before, I found out that BlueVelvet was not the only one, and not the first to use this method. Some of the players I was told did it, are very nice, good players, and I find it hard to believe they would cheat deliberately. That's why I gave everyone the benefit of the doubt and believed that maybe they just didn't realize what they were doing was unfair, and wrong, I don't know, and don't care. What I do care about is the act itself "the method", which I think should not be encouraged, and not approved.

If expressing opinions about what is perceived as unfair is wrong, I don't want to be right!

However, it is an etiquette problem. Etiquette isn't really enforced here, nor should it be, it is something we, the users, create together.

While I completely agree with you that etiquette is irrelevant to fairness and integrity of the game. I personally disagree that the issue debated is "an etiquette problem" and from what I've been told by players, I am not the only one feeling this way.

Here are some examples:

It is not a must to wish good luck and say gg, but it is customary and newcomers pick up on that very quickly.

These are unwritten rules. Not even rules. Etiquette. This is how communities work, not sure you could explain it to an alien. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I think lowering your own score like this is starting to be frowned upon. It was a novelty when it first happened, now it is like not saying gg, and maybe later it will become like breaking truces.

I think there is no comparison between something completely insignificant like not wishing good luck or gg, and using an artificial way to lower points that impacts the scores of many players. Dozens of players in this case, which I assume don't even realize they are impacted by it.

If it wasn't criticized right away, it's not because it's "an etiquette issue" but rather because sometimes it takes time to realize the implications of such an act. As I said, I honestly believe that some of them did not really intend to do anything bad really, and just didn't fully realize the implications on the integrity of the game that their act had. I initially included BlueVelvet in my benefit of the doubt, but after he repeated his act just today after fully being aware of this controversy, it's clearly not done in good faith, and if before he wasn't aware of how dozens of players are robbed of their points, now he surely is, and maybe that's precisely while he is doing it.


It is not against the rules, and in this sense you certainly didn't do anything wrong, and you won't get warned or banned or anything but it seems like people don't like it these days.

After getting the green light, support and approval, through these words, BlueVelvet today repeated that "trick" and he continued to rob players of their points in two methods. I will explain to those who don't realize it how they are being depraved of their points which are granted to BlueVelvet's partners.

The current victims who probably don't even realize they have their points robbed from them are: riskyone, commander 77, ElToad, engelbrekt1390 (who was already robbed before, and will be again several times), Tapeworm, youredead, Worldruler2010, rperry96, Hortik, gipper624, norbs, Mid-Mainer, SgtPatton, Number2, elricsbiscuit, -MAVERICK-, halfslam, chang50, Edman6, Napoleon43, Yadu, CryptoJim, maintain, Springsteen, patrick111341, StJude, Jazz9000, LeVillaeEmroled, Sunshinealliance, KersekM, KyleA, Redstorm, Stugotz, SubwayatNight, BadElmer, Cardinalsrule, airwick, Tyro, Derswick, ruud, hummingman, H Barca, forzacalcio, calume, Kilgore, Disturbed, TheGeneral, palmono, patriot, matildathehun, ponyboy55, SJ99, Smaryll, jasmine1978, lucaluca, panos1200, VaFanqulo, rdrisktaker, micky, edsdad, F15FreeEagle, Charlee55, Schnet2, Leor888, KowBoy, sniperken, linearcurve, valecnik, bilsi, zonie, eseuelonio, brianstheman, Kazaam, grons, blee, Nerya, bareham, empirejeff and more... To name "a few"... Some of them have already paid over 200 points, and some who are in a few games with the gentleman are expected to pay even more. Keep in mind, even when he is eliminated, you are still being deprived of points you should be paid for taking on a risk which you took yet you didn't get paid for as you deserved.

Those who are in team games against BlueVelvet where he wants to help his partners and keep lowering his score to 500 would be robbed in one of the following two ways:

1) If you lose, instead of losing what you normally would have lost (probably around 30 points) you would lose the average of what you should lose to his partner and a 100). In some cases you would lose a 100 points, in others if you're lucky, a little less.

2) If you win, you're lucky to have evaded losing 100 points, but unfortunately you are still robbed of the points you deserve, which are rightfully yours. Instead of getting the 45 points you would have got from beating BlueVelvet you will only get 5 points, and be robbed of 40 points that should have been yours.

So any player who can find a "sponsor", who volunteers to keep their score at 500, can get into team games like BlueVelvet did, and then if you lose, no big deal, you lose very few points, almost a half of what you were supposed to, and if you win, the reward is huge. At least 50 extra points per team beat.

I don't think that's "an etiquette problem", I think that's a serious problem to the integrity of the game, but that's just my opinion.
 

riskyone

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I think Veni brings up some good points about points here. In my last post I said that I didn't approve of it. He listed not just a few but many players impacted by this and it will only continue unless like pointed out. One entry per person, per tournament. I play for fun and there will always be ways to lower score. Start 50 games and attack neutrals and skip turns and in a month you will be at the lowest rank. I like strategy. That is why I play and for fun. I think it's a lot easier to rise from ashes then to be in the top and stay there. Something hard to do. ..riskyone
 

chang50

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As his current victim I would like to suggest a system where you can foe opponents you don't wish to play this sort of anti social behavior being a very good reason to do so.It works well on conquer club.If nothing is done the inevitable result will be players dropping out..
 

ndrm31

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download.jpg
 

Cardinalsrule

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As his current victim I would like to suggest a system where you can foe opponents you don't wish to play this sort of anti social behavior being a very good reason to do so.It works well on conquer club.If nothing is done the inevitable result will be players dropping out..

A system like that will be implemented in the new game engine, but not now. The coders are concentrating on getting the new engine finished and won't be working on anything in the old one, barring a catastrophic failure.

That being said, CentCom will be looking into other ways to curb this behavior and/or stop the inequities. For starters, ANYONE who has lost ~100 points to BlueVelvet can send myself or th-child a link to the game, and we can manually put the points back.
 

chang50

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A system like that will be implemented in the new game engine, but not now. The coders are concentrating on getting the new engine finished and won't be working on anything in the old one, barring a catastrophic failure.

That being said, CentCom will be looking into other ways to curb this behavior and/or stop the inequities. For starters, ANYONE who has lost ~100 points to BlueVelvet can send myself or th-child a link to the game, and we can manually put the points back.

Thank you..
 

blee

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A system like that will be implemented in the new game engine, but not now. The coders are concentrating on getting the new engine finished and won't be working on anything in the old one, barring a catastrophic failure.

That being said, CentCom will be looking into other ways to curb this behavior and/or stop the inequities. For starters, ANYONE who has lost ~100 points to BlueVelvet can send myself or th-child a link to the game, and we can manually put the points back.

Thank you sir! I dropped you a note. Thanks to VVV for the heads up, I don’t think I had played much with BV in the past and was embarrassed I lost so badly to someone with such a poor rank ;)
 

ndrm31

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A system like that will be implemented in the new game engine, but not now. The coders are concentrating on getting the new engine finished and won't be working on anything in the old one, barring a catastrophic failure.

That being said, CentCom will be looking into other ways to curb this behavior and/or stop the inequities. For starters, ANYONE who has lost ~100 points to BlueVelvet can send myself or th-child a link to the game, and we can manually put the points back.

Actually trere is another player , well know by all, a good player, and good person for what I see that deicided to give several k of points away, just to prove himself, how fast he would come back, meanwhilr, I and many players where victims of this EGO, losing tons of points on ongoing tourney games
 

Veni-Vidi-Vici

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Actually trere is another player , well know by all, a good player, and good person for what I see that deicided to give several k of points away, just to prove himself, how fast he would come back, meanwhilr, I and many players where victims of this EGO, losing tons of points on ongoing tourney games

The past is in the past, and it's impossible to fix all the wrongs retroactively, and at once. We should look at the 99.99% full of the glass. Cardinalsrule news about the new game engine is terrific. As well as expressing that this "behavior" should stop.
 

ndrm31

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The past is in the past, and it's impossible to fix all the wrongs retroactively, and at once. We should look at the 99.99% full of the glass. Cardinalsrule news about the new game engine is terrific. As well as expressing that this "behavior" should stop.

I agree, but talking about the present, by the way, this thread is called,I m happy beacause, come here just to post why I was hapy, and took a gklance to all this messages that shal be in anther thread
 

Veni-Vidi-Vici

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I agree, but talking about the present, by the way, this thread is called,I m happy beacause, come here just to post why I was hapy, and took a gklance to all this messages that shal be in anther thread

LMAO, you made me laugh so hard... and I guess that made me happy... So there...
 

ndrm31

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download.jpg


ditto
 

riskyone

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very nice. You are like a Super Hero when it comes to tournaments the last 4 months. Cool A** Tattoo 51 and going strong. Mr.W.W. has nothing on you.:neo::alberteinstein:
 

ndrm31

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very nice. You are like a Super Hero when it comes to tournaments the last 4 months. Cool A** Tattoo 51 and going strong. Mr.W.W. has nothing on you.:neo::alberteinstein:

lol had to google Mr. W.W
 
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